Small business marketing

HappyHarry said: "Let's talk about some of the ways small businesses can market: Online is probably the most affordable. If the business owner is very savvy, he can keep his costs low and make good money online. I think traditional print advertising is very unreliable for the average small business owner."

chahinemm said: "mass media (TV radoi ect...) is an option but also costs a lot and depending on audiance. chahinemm"

misterjover said: "Word of mouth is the most effective marketing... referral exchange as well as cross selling."

Yoshimi said: "billboards, anything that works, recorded phone calls, and even walking around and putting flyers on peoples door steps, just to get publicity and get people talking about your buisiness.. but hey im only 14, and the lawn mowing buisinesses that i started i use that technique and get like 25 yards.. it works well"

lil dickie said: "I know it sounds corny, but Word of Mouth is the lifeline of any small business. Happy customers will refer other happy customers."

chahinemm said: "definitely true duckie but now how does the internet word of mouth come in play the amount of people you are going to meet online face to face who might ask u about a product is limited compared to if u have friends or people in the neighborhood. just a taught. chahine"

AkeTyvi said: ""When a capitalist sees other capitalist, he surely makes the difference" – they say. I suppose a man knows from who he purchases his stuff. Maybe in person to trade and to get the first impression. A fair or a street show is pretty good idea too. :cool: -- I built a screen of 5500 small & middle size businesses with a result of 3 to 4 interested in. I used I-net marketing. These days I let them enter, in case they need anything. So, I went to street level to see the managers and I noticed two things; they usually lack money or they are too busy. I think I'm going to try TV next, because if people are this lazy, why should I be nothing as lazy as them. The old Local Radio Network is still a valid idea in States, so could be pretty cheap and would get the businessman close to people. Rather an interview type, than only a hard selling discussion; some of us like to know the man behind the scenes. And I definitely will book myself into this once a month CEO’s breakfast meeting. It a great day to start business day too. I might like to use some on line stream video, but not with this budget; government has got me money now. And lost of other means. Mixing things sounds good, but it is not so easy. :rolleyes: -- How should I really know. :D I hardly passed my marketing, while undergraduate. I still remember some marketing mix and we were not talking about sweets :) ."

roadwarrior said: ""good products sell themselves!" that phrase (or something close to that) is very well supported by word of mouth marketing if people like a product, they will tell their acquaitances about it..."

HappyHarry said: "Word of mouth is great once you have an installed user-base, but early on you have to get the word out."

colden said: "My advice: Get a domain name and build a website. Then market it. It's a little harder than it sounds, but is well worth the time and effort. If nothing else, your print/radio/tv ads, business cards, etc., can publicize your site, as in, "For more information and pictures, please go to www.myGreatSiter.com""

AlfredSokol said: "It's good advice. Domain names and web hosting are also very cheap these days."

Bezzle01 said: "I learned from my dad (who has a successful small business of 15+ years) to do the job right and let your work speak for itself. If you do quality work in whatever business people will talk, which in return gives you refferals. Kinda goes along with word of mouth. He started working out of his house doing side work and now he has about 14 employees working from his office. It takes time but dont outgrow your knowlege. If you dont know how to run a company with 20 people working for you, dont bite off that amount untill your ready."

chief_quimby said: "[QUOTE]It's good advice. Domain names and web hosting are also very cheap these days.[/QUOTE] That's true. Conveniently, here's a question from a webhost: How do we price our plans to attract customers when other hosts are offering cheaper packages? Mind you, most of these guys are overselling their servers and have lousy service but people don't usually look beyond the price. How do we compete with these people who are much more tenacious at marketting than us?"

LanceJ said: "[QUOTE=HappyHarry]Let's talk about some of the ways small businesses can market: Online is probably the most affordable. If the business owner is very savvy, he can keep his costs low and make good money online. I think traditional print advertising is very unreliable for the average small business owner.[/QUOTE] If your a very small business owner like myself, you can't afford someone who specializes in marketing. You have your owner hat, your accountant hat, your customer service hat, your taxes hat, and your marketing hat. Putting on the marketing hat, here's my wisdom. It depends on the product you sell and your target consumers. I'll never forget when I first started about 10 years ago, I thought that running an Advertisement in the San Franciso Chronicle would be awesome. Not only was there like 1 million people who read that paper so if I could nail just 1% of those million people I'd be rich overnight, but I was moving out of the webworld with my software and into reality. The AD cost $600 for 1 day for a little, small strip, right along side like a ghazillion others. I didn't get one sale from my fantasy trip. Know your consumer. Know what publications in both web and standard print, that they are most likely to read. Know people they are most likely to talk with, and get your foot in the door with those people for awesome referrals. At its essence, search engine keywords are nothing more than knowing your consumer carried into the digital world, knowing your consumer and what they are most likely to type in to a search engine and do web searches under. If you'd like to be more forth coming about what business you are specifically talking about Happy Harry and what the product is, I'll give you some practical ideas you can put to use.... of course once we work out how much you're going to pay me for my advice."

LanceJ said: "[QUOTE=chief_quimby]That's true. Conveniently, here's a question from a webhost: How do we price our plans to attract customers when other hosts are offering cheaper packages? Mind you, most of these guys are overselling their servers and have lousy service but people don't usually look beyond the price. How do we compete with these people who are much more tenacious at marketting than us?[/QUOTE] How do your price your plans? If the competition is able to offer lower prices than you are, you're doing something wrong. They are more efficient and better able to cut corners than you. You are at a competitive disadvantage and will get your butt kicked. So, lower your prices to be more competively priced. If you feel you have a competitive advantage because you don't "oversell" your servers, or that you have better customer service, advertise these to the max. Let potential consumers know what makes you better than the competition. Re-author your entire website around the "we don't oversell" our servers, and "you are gurantee to get a response back from us within 24 hours" or whatever else you do better than the competition. You can even contract out to some business writers who will write an article about how you are better than the competition and why, and then you can put that article in the Press Releases hyperlink on your domain hosting website. In the end, there's only one thing you need to strive for, total annihilation of your competitors through both superior price and superior service... or in otherwords, superior product. Rationalizing why you can't lower your prices, or why you can't market as effectively, is going to be your undoing."

drdan said: "I agree with most everything Lance just posted save for one thing "lowering your price". In most markets price means very little to the average consumer. Most studies indicate that on the top five things people look for when buying from a chosen company price is 4th or 5th. It is everything else that matters. If price where a main concern of most people then in the auto industry we would all be driving Kia Rio's, but I know Dr. Stock drives a nice Mercedes which is 10 times the cost of the Rio. Now this is an extreme example but it does hold true for almost every industry. In the web hosting industry price is a little more competitive however if the server is crap and has slow speeds or is down at more than 1% (hell even .5% of the time) I am moving regardless if it will cost me $5 more a month it is not worth it. Those are the things that cost me money and at the speed of the internet today time is definitely worth money. Your customer service must be great as well. I love one of my web hosting services they have 24/7 chat with COMPETENT people answering my questions. How do you market web hosting? Well you have to ask yourself how do people find out about web hosting? When someone goes looking for a webhosting service what do they do to find it? Still number 1, hands down, "word of mouth". Now it is different than going and asking your neighbor or friend which web hosting service they use, instead they go to one of the sites that compares web hosting services and gives recommendations and reasons why they are recommending a certain web host. So you need to check out the competition that is ranked number 1 through 3 and compete against them. Offer more service at the same price, or better yet offer more at a higher price and realize you are worth that. You are more worried about price than you think your consumer is. Now if you can not offer the same or more than the top 3 webhosts that keep popping up on all the comparison sites, then price does become more important. However you still will not get me or the majority of customers."

LanceJ said: "[QUOTE=drdan]I agree with most everything Lance just posted save for one thing "lowering your price". In most markets price means very little to the average consumer. Most studies indicate that on the top five things people look for when buying from a chosen company price is 4th or 5th. It is everything else that matters. If price where a main concern of most people then in the auto industry we would all be driving Kia Rio's, but I know Dr. Stock drives a nice Mercedes which is 10 times the cost of the Rio. Now this is an extreme example but it does hold true for almost every industry.[/QUOTE] What? Oh no... this forum needs more entrepenuers, that's what's missing here. Anyone who doesn't have better business sense to know that "price is everything" needs to wake up. Most studies, what, most studies done by moron liberal instructors? Those who can't do, teach sort of people? And what's this comparison to a Kia? The quality is crap. You get what you pay for is the lesson learned with buying at Kia. I can pull a comparison as well that confirms my point. Wal Mart. The most successful business in America right now. A superior product at a superior price beats any liberal study done every time. It's so simple, it comfounds people that try and overthink it. Cheapest price and best quality = #1. A STUDY that shows price is ranked 4th or 5th....LOL... nuff said."

drdan said: "[QUOTE=LanceJ]What? Oh no... this forum needs more entrepenuers, that's what's missing here. Anyone who doesn't have better business sense to know that "price is everything" needs to wake up.[/quote] Couldn't disagree with you more. If you think price is everything and you are trying to sell something, you will be waking up poor one day. [Quote=LanceJ] And what's this comparison to a Kia? The quality is crap. You get what you pay for is the lesson learned with buying at Kia.[/quote] Agreed, makes my point. You are arguing for me now, Lance. :) [Quote=LanceJ] I can pull a comparison as well that confirms my point. Wal Mart. The most successful business in America right now. A superior product at a superior price beats any liberal study done every time.[/quote] Disagree. Walmart, although a fantastic company, does not match up with quality or superior product. People buy their everyday products at Walmart for a good price. People go to Walmart because "they have everything you need." Need being the key word there. You go to Walmart because they have it and they have good customer service from the greeter at the door to the multiple cashiers they have so you are not waiting in line forever. Walmart has made a niche in which they say price matters, hence they are always slashing prices. But Superior product??? If you think they have superior products you need buy other things than just toilet paper and toothpaste! [Quote=LanceJ] It's so simple, it comfounds people that try and overthink it. Cheapest price and best quality = #1.[/quote] Here's where your thinking is flawed, you can not always get the best quality at the cheapest price. What you want to say, and I think we can agree on, is that you want the "best perceived value". Great Quality at a Great Price, not necessarily the cheapest. Let's take something real, my own business. Not a study (I'll get back to those in a minute) my own business. For a chiropractic treatment on a horse I charge $90. There are several other vets/chiros in my area most of them are less expensive than I am for the same service. If price were everything I would have no clients; however I have so many clients that I am not accepting any new ones. I raised my prices from $80 to $90 over the past year and from $70 the year before, have I lost some clients? A few but I have gained more than I have lost. Why??? If price where everything I would have lost all my clients because there is someone cheaper providing the same service, they would have gotten all my business. In your model it makes no sense why I haven't. I haven't because of perceived value. Whether it be the hours I have, my glowing personality and bedside manner, the job I do, the results they see vs. someone else, or my reputation, it doesn't matter they all come before price. Otherwise I would no longer be in business. In a niche market in an activity that people have passion for - price is almost meaningless! Obviously there is a point in which the majority of people will not pay and you will start losing money but it goes back to perceived value not the cheapest on the market. Now the problem here is this. Is Web Hosting a niche market? Unfortunately the answer to that is yes and no. Yes because not everyone needs web hosting; however everyone that wants a web site NEEDS web hosting. So in this case price does matter a little more, but no where near as much as in Walmarts case in which the majority of product they sell is need based. SO I still think other things are more important than price in this case. [Quote=LanceJ] Most studies, what, most studies done by moron liberal instructors? Those who can't do, teach sort of people? A STUDY that shows price is ranked 4th or 5th....LOL... nuff said.[/QUOTE] Actually I was paraphrasing what was told to me by several marketers and entrepreneurs, so the use of the word study was incorrectly used, as I personally have no studies to back that statement up. I apologize for making a statement without the supporting documentation to back it up. I did find one suggesting cost does not matter as much as cost benefit but it is from Harvard so that won't satisfy you. ;) However, the individual marketers and entrepreneurs - don't know their political tendencies sorry, I'll guess at couple for you though Lance :D - that profess such "studies" from their real life world are Corey Rudl, Matt Furey(conservative), Daren Falter, Seth Godin (liberal), Mark Victor Hansen (liberal), Robert Allen (moderate - OK liberal, for you Rush fans), and a few others. All millionaires, all professing that price is not as important as you are making it out to be. Just look at what Corey (although now deceased) was selling, and his company is still selling, a computer program called MailLoop for $600. It is a mail merge program with the capabilities of sending out bulk email without your ISP thinking it is spam. My computer programmer made one for me in less than a day and cost me next to nothing. So why is Corey's program still selling when anyone can go to Elance or some other place and find a computer programmer to make a personalized program for 1/4 to 1/2 the price? If price were everything his business would have to close up. Percieved Value is the ticket and it is not complicated either. The cheapest does not always win. In many cases if you go cheap you are leaving money on the table because someone is willing to buy at a higher price for perceived value. Great value at a great price. Oh by the way, I am an entrepreneur. :p"

LanceJ said: "You sure don't sound like an entrepeneur from the trenches. Look, to say price ranks 4th or 5th is stupid. I'm not going to listen to that sort of nonsense. It reads like a pro-America, America First group trying to get consumers to buy American goods by telling them price is 4th or 5th on the list of importance. I'm not arguing your point in regards to the Kia. The Kia is a load of crap, that's why it's cheap and that's why using it to support your claim is dumb. It's price AND quality. If you want to use cars for an example, GM and FORD both tried to market that price was less important, and look at what happened to them. Your ignorance in regards to price being #1 is exemplified by the Forbes 500 list. 15 years ago, about 50 businesses listed on the Forbes 500 had either plants or outsourcing in India. Today, over 350 businesses on the Forbes 500 list have major operations in India. In the near future, that number will be closer to all 500. What do you think the whole outsourcing debate is about? Price. Today, if you want to sell your quality products at a competitive price, you cut your costs and pass on that savings to the consumer by manufacturing your products in India. That's exactly how Wal Mart gets their products, via China and India. And people go to Wal Mart because it's cheap. I've bought TV sets and DVD players from Wal Mart. Wal Mart is at the center of controversy because they offer products at a cheaper price because most of the products they sell are not manufactured here in the U.S. The entire quest of business is to sell your product at an ever decreasing price, that's why you don't sound like or act like an entrepeneur. People involved in health care, because of health insurance, don't operate in a free market but rather something closer to communism, where prices are set as to what the insurance companies will pay (that's why you don't understand how to use price to effectively increase your sales, because you don't have to.). In health care, costs generally move in one direction, up. In your [B]last post[/B] you write: "Percieved Value is the ticket and it is not complicated either. The cheapest does not always win. In many cases if you go cheap you are leaving money on the table because someone is willing to buy at a higher price for perceived value. [U]Great value at a great price[/U]." but you [B]originally[/B] wrote: "I agree with most everything Lance just posted save for one thing "lowering your price". In most markets price means very little to the average consumer. Most studies indicate that on the top five things people look for when buying from a chosen company price is 4th or 5th. [U]It is everything else that matters.[/U]" Oh, so now you've come around to saying exactly what I said, a quality product at a cheap price. That's a long way from saying you believe in a study you read somewhere that says price is ranked 4th or 5th. You're now putting it right up there in a #1 position with quality, which is where it should be. I hate it when people do that, they try and sneak into a more centrist position during a debate, hoping you don't notice. Look, I'm gonna help you out here. Here's where you open yourself up to getting slammed. You wrote: "I agree with most everything Lance just posted save for one thing "lowering your price". I've spoke on here at length about two kinds of people, pioneers and critiquers. Pioneers create an idea or concept, critiquers only know how to critically post about somebody elses idea. The goal of higher education is "critical thought", not "idea generation". This is a failure of education. The goal should be idea generation after critical thought. I think the education system thinks it's too difficult to teach idea generation, so they stop at critical thought. If you felt the need to post a comment, you should have just presented your idea. You'll notice I lead by example. If a question is posed, I present my response to the person who asked the question. Instead, you read everyone elses responses, then you say something like "I agree with most everything Lance just posted save for one thing "lowering your price". Sort of like you can't just present your idea on its own and just let it fly, you have to try and discredit or at least talk down someone elses idea before posting your idea. That arrogance is just not necessary. It's sort of like you are trying too hard to sound like you are smart or something (aka DRdan). Most people who are smart with a PhD don't want to be called DR. In fact, they make no mention they have a doctorate at all. It's the people with PhDs that demand others call them DR, that are the insecure, sort of dumb ones. Just respond to the original question if you so desire and put your idea out there. If someone likes it great, if not, oh well. Prefacing your posts with "I disagree with what XXXXXX wrote" is going to get you into debates where you get spanked everytime."

HappyHarry said: "Price almost always wins when you match features. If all features are equal and the price is the same, the product with the lower price will win out in the end because of human nature. That being said, for a service product like DrDan describes, raising the price might make sense. Especially if you get paid more for less work. If it's work you don't like much, it make sense to raise the price to where you do the work less often."

drdan said: "[QUOTE=LanceJ] The entire quest of business is to sell your product at an ever decreasing price, that's why you don't sound like or act like an entrepeneur.[/quote] Now THAT is Stupid! It is the total opposite you want to sell your product for an ever INCREASING price. What you want to decrease is your cost to produce so you profit more. Your reference to outsourcing is based on cost not price. Aren't you an accountant??? Two opposite ends of the balance sheet one is expense the other is income. [quote=LanceJ] Oh, so now you've come around to saying exactly what I said, a quality product at a cheap price. That's a long way from saying you believe in a study you read somewhere that says price is ranked 4th or 5th. You're now putting it right up there in a #1 position with quality, which is where it should be. I hate it when people do that, they try and sneak into a more centrist position during a debate, hoping you don't notice.[/quote] No that is not what I am saying at all and it wasn't what you were saying either. What I got out of your statement was that people are very concerned about price and cheapest is the way to go, undercut all your competitors and you will win. I disagree with that, there are more important things to people than price. Offer a better product or better service at the same price or in some cases a higher price and you will profit more than your competitors. [quote=LanceJ] Look, I'm gonna help you out here. Here's where you open yourself up to getting slammed. You wrote: "I agree with most everything Lance just posted save for one thing "lowering your price". [/quote] Didn't realize that this is what got your panties in a bunch. Next time I will refrain from giving you credit for something I agree with you about. [Quote=LanceJ]you have to try and discredit or at least talk down someone elses idea before posting your idea. That arrogance is just not necessary.[/quote] Lance I am really sorry that you felt I was trying to discredit you, that was not my intention. I truly did agree with everything you had said except for lowering prices. Sometimes interpretation is out of the control of the writer on forums and what you take out of what was written was not given the right inflection or connotation. If you take what I said at face value I was giving you credit save for lowering prices. I was complimenting you not discrediting you and disagreeing with one point out of the entire post. [Quote=LanceJ] It's sort of like you are trying too hard to sound like you are smart or something (aka DRdan). Most people who are smart with a PhD don't want to be called DR. In fact, they make no mention they have a doctorate at all. It's the people with PhDs that demand others call them DR, that are the insecure, sort of dumb ones.[/quote] Why when you get into disagreements on this forum do you go personal? If you knew me you would know that I really do not 'demand' others to call me DR. Quite the opposite; however the name has stuck and I even have friends and family that joke around with it because it is a catchy phrase. Also, it is just a username on a forum, that is almost always available so I use it, that is all. I could careless, if you want to call me Dan that is fine. I use my letters at the end of my name in my sig for two reasons. 1. It goes with my favorite quote of all time, also in my sig. 2. I am proud of it. It was a lifetime goal of mine that I achieved. [quote=LanceJ] going to get you into debates where you get spanked everytime.[/QUOTE] :eek: In your dreams! :D Honestly I do not want to get into personal argument with you, it helps no one. I respect you and your opinions, but stick to the actual disagreement and don't go personal and you will maintain mine and everyone elses respect for you. Lets stick with the disagreement at hand - you think cheaper in price is the way to go and I feel there are more important aspects to making profit than price alone. And after reading your last post I think besides the statement about selling at an ever decreasing price (which I am sorry is still a stupid statement), we are at an agreement. "Quality at a good price". However we are looking at it from two different ends. It seems that you wish to decrease costs and cut corners to lower your price to beat out your competitiors. My answer to this is that you can compromise quality when you cut corners and many times it is difficult to cut expenses, so it is better to improve on other items such as customer service or improve the quality of product. The reason I say this is because (and this is my whole argument that you seem to disagree with) the consumer cares more about these things than price. Let me quote the original poster that started this little disagreement... "How do we price our plans to attract customers when other hosts are offering cheaper packages? Mind you, most of these guys are overselling their servers and have lousy service but people don't usually look beyond the price." I disagree with his premise that people don't usually look beyond the price, when in fact they do and I agreed with you stating "If you feel you have a competitive advantage because you don't "oversell" your servers, or that you have better customer service, advertise these to the max. Let potential consumers know what makes you better than the competition. Re-author your entire website around the "we don't oversell" our servers, and "you are gurantee to get a response back from us within 24 hours" or whatever else you do better than the competition." This statement is why you do not decrease your price. You give them more and you can charge the higher price because people WILL pay. Why will they pay? Because price is not the most important thing! Now do you have a problem with this, have I clarified my position, and above all else, am I still your friend - OK some guy on a forum that you have not blacklisted. ;)"

drdan said: "Doing that whole post and I made a mistake in the first sentence which is important!!! I did not mean to state that "It is the total opposite you want to sell your product for an ever INCREASING price." The goal is INCREASING PROFIT! Whether that means decreasing costs or increasing value is the goal of a business not decreasing price."

LanceJ said: "[QUOTE=drdan]Doing that whole post and I made a mistake in the first sentence which is important!!! I did not mean to state that "It is the total opposite you want to sell your product for an ever INCREASING price." The goal is INCREASING PROFIT! Whether that means decreasing costs or increasing value is the goal of a business not decreasing price.[/QUOTE] I can't keep up with you, first it's price is 4th or 5th on the list of most important things, then it's price is equal to quality in the #1 position, then it's you want to sell your product for an ever increasing price, and now it's increasing profit whether than means decreasing costs or increasing value. It's easy to overthink something and make it more complicated than it really is. I give up. I have no idea what you are talking about anymore. I keep things simple and to the point. My original message is simple and to the point. I think I understand enough of what you are saying, or were saying, to say that you don't agree with my post, and that's your right. It sounds like you want to get along with me and so avoid judging someone elses ideas unless it's a stock recommendation that can cost a newbie money or a thread you started. Do that and we'll get along just fine."

drdan said: "I am sorry to have confused you Lance. I agree the idea is simple. I am obviously not conveying the message for you to understand what I am saying so I will also give up. I can't say that I will avoid other discussions, but you have yourself a deal on getting along."

wildmandan32 said: "ok from the trenches.... ok I'm going to avoid this part of the conversation, but I would like to say that lowering my prices in business almost put me out of business, I raised my prices (was the most expensive in city) and i attracted a whole new set of customers, the ones who were willing to pay for quality and service, versus the cheapskates...i think it is important for all business owners to realize that they are not only selling their products/skills you should be selling service. ask your customers for referrals it will make your business SKYROCKET"

HappyHarry said: "I think there's a metaphysical reason for that Wildman. It's almost as if raising your prices tells the universe your worth more. With professional services, pricing shouldn't be as big of a concern. Did OJ say Johnnie Cochran was too expensive? No, he paid him because he needed his help."

InvestorInMN said: "Im actually a marketing manager for a law firm. Also a webdesigner/graphic designer. All the money i make doing websites I now invest! One really good advertisement idea is if your a local business like I am, is flyers. Get a printer, have them black and white even. Pass them around, coffee shops, resturants, librarys. Might be alot of driving, but what 1 or 2 times a month, as long as you place them nicely."

HappyHarry said: "That's an interesting idea. I wonder if it would work for a web-based company. Will people type the URL in the bar?"

InvestorInMN said: "well i market a local company so doing locally is best for me web based companies best thing is Google pay per click"

drdan said: "Oh how I wish Lance was here. While working on another project I found the article I was refering to as a study in my "discussion" on price with Lance and I had to share it with all of you. I know I have a sickness to continue a dead argument when the other person is not even here anymore. Sorry but it is good information and it does pertain to this thread. For those of you that do not know, Dan Kennedy is probably the most well know and most successful business marketer of the pre-internet era. However, his ideas are universal enough that many internet marketers are utilizing his ideas to really supercharge their marketing. Anyway here are a couple of excerpts from that article... [B]What Business Owners Don't Know About Price by Dan Kennedy[/B] "For starters, they do not understand how elastic price is. Only a small percentage of buyers (of anything) base their decisions solely on getting the cheapest price. If most did, you'd see more Yugos on the road than any other car." ..... "They do not understand that different people buy at different price levels. Yes, there is a Wal-Mart customer - probably in every category of retail sales. But there is also a Neiman Marcus customer. You can get a steak dinner at Denny's and you can get a steak dinner at Morton's....In other words, there are many customers for whom price is low on the totem pole. It's up to you to pick your target market."..... "They make a misguided attempt to compete on price. If you can't be THE cheapest, there's no benefit in being almost the cheapest. Find another way to compete. A client of mine who consults with the restaurant industry told me about a gourmet pizza take-out and delivery shop that he's been working with. They are in a small city where they compete with 127 other pizzerias. 127! They have the highest prices of all of them, they do no 2-for-1 deals - and yet they doubled their sales and more than doubled their profits last year. Key Word:Gourmet." This is just a small rendition of the 2 page article and I hope it explains where I was coming from in my discussion with Lance. I know it probably would not have satisfied Lance (wish he were here to argue back). However, I think I am going to listen to the world reknown expert on this one rather than Lance even if he was here to try and dispute this article."

breakingwallstreet said: "Dan, I gotta agree with everything you've said. My primary income stream is via a jewelry business I started about 4 years ago. I can tell anyone and everyone first hand, that some of the most profitable jewelers in our industry are also the most expensive. I know a guy who doesn't sell anything under $25,000. His biggest sale ever was over $8,000,000.00 for a single piece of jewelry, and this is with 30% - 60% profit margins. As much as I hate to admit it, he makes more in one month than we do in one year. And look at a company like Tiffany and Co. Their products are extremely expensive, but they are one of the most well known jewelry stores in the world. Are they the top in profits each year? No...but they are usually top 10. Furthermore, they can do it with less employees, retail locations, and pieces sold...so less effort to make a whole lot. Price is only #1 for things like gasoline and milk...and even then, I know brand names that do better than the discount versions of the exact same product ;) Greg P"

mar31977 said: "What do you think about MAN MADE diamonds. I halted all buying of diamonds years ago and went to Tanzanite and Alexandrite . ."

breakingwallstreet said: "Man Made diamonds such as Cubic Zirconia (which aren't diamonds at all) have no value at all, intrinsic or otherwise. They also tend to look...well, fake, so I wouldn't recommend them, unless you happen to fall in love with a piece of costume jewelry. As far as mossanite goes, a mossanite stone is generally as close to a diamond as you can possibly get. There are only 1 or 2 tests in the world that can tell the difference, and only top gem labs have the money to do such testing. They can be cut perfectly and flawlessly, and therefore can be quite beautiful. Also, they tend to be about 25-35% less than an equivilent natural diamond. Just bear in mind that no other gemstone has the allure or mystique of a diamond, but mossanite is as good as it gets, without being a natural diamond. Hope this answers your question! Greg P"

drdan said: "[QUOTE=breakingwallstreet] Price is only #1 for things like gasoline and milk...and even then, I know brand names that do better than the discount versions of the exact same product ;)[/QUOTE] Absolutely, I love my Oberweiss milk delivery!!! The best chocolate milk anywhere! It costs about twice as much as an ordinary gallon of milk in the store!"

alhamid said: "i always charge the highest price."

natser said: "I think the best way and the most garanteed way for business to sell more it get a network marketing system up and running. Live selling is the best in my opinion and most likely if the product is good the customer will get it. Pay your team good and they will sell your product very effectively and no traditional marketing will be needed! Traditional marketing is much much more expensive then network marketing."

drdan said: "[QUOTE=natser]I think the best way and the most garanteed way for business to sell more it get a network marketing system up and running. Live selling is the best in my opinion and most likely if the product is good the customer will get it. Pay your team good and they will sell your product very effectively and no traditional marketing will be needed! Traditional marketing is much much more expensive then network marketing.[/QUOTE] In most instances network marketing will not work in selling a product or service. Brick and mortar stores; Hard services such as plumbing, hair cutting, lawn mowing, or my favorite vet services; restaurants; gas stations; etc are all businesses used everyday that true network marketing will not work for. Now the number one concept which is word of mouth will work. In fact in network marketing that is the idea for the company behind the network marketers. They have a product that they want to sell so they want to build an army of people that talk about it. They do not really care if you sell one thing they just want you talking about it so that it receives exposure and eventually with enough exposure someone, lots of someones, will buy. Also network marketing is not a guarantee to success, there are many many network marketing companies that fail just like traditional companies. Oh and do you realize that each individual network marketer uses conpcepts and ideas from traditional marketing to get more sales? Now the company behind the network marketer is still paying for that in commissions."

Mackie said: "Most of this thread has been about pricing and it is an investment site, so we all should know a little something about business. Anyone who has read anything by Buffett about the business he bought as Berkshire Hathaway in the textile industry will know about lowering prices vs the competition. As prices were lowered, the competitors lowered further. New infrastructure was required to maintain the firms competitive position and thus increasing costs and lowering margins still further. It is a viscious cycle. Sure, he classed it as a 'commodity' and so has little value added, but still the argument largely holds. If WB thinks that, who am I (or we) to disagree??"

Mackie said: "Since this was about marketing, customer care has been my number one. I do all I can to help my clients and I have a number of structured ways and times that I ask for referrals. It helps me no end. The other thing I did, which was ridiculous really ... I started taking my clients to lunch!! I'm a financial consultant. Once they had spent an hour or two chatting with me about life in general, they no longer saw me as a threat or sharp salesman, but as the nice, normal guy I am. From there, extra business and referrals really started to come. Odd that my favourite thing (eating) could help build business."