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Which Broker???

Petree Dish said: "I just typed out this big ass first thread and when I went to post it I hadn't logged in yet and it deleted it all... doh! I don't know if I have the strength to retype it all! haha It's nice to meet you all. I am a complete investing n00b and I was wondering if you guys had some recommendations for brokers... I'm 23, and I have around 20-30k that I am looking to invest into the market but am having trouble finding a place to start. I actually know where I want to invest the money, I even know who, but I don't really know how... I know that I need a broker, but beyond that, are there other resources I need to acquire before investing my monies? Any help would be great and I really appreciate you guys being here to help! Regards, -Bryan"

molder101 said: "There are hundreds of newbie posts on here. The first place to start would be to do a search on the forum for those. Do your research, so if you do go to get a broker he doesn't rip you off. Otherwise, you could always invest the money yourself via Etrade or Sogotrade or one of those websites. If you are unsure of what to buy, look at the ETFs which tend to be similar to mutual funds without the huge buy in and continuous fees (could be .07% to .19% for ETFs vs. .5% to over 2%). 20-30k is quite a bit of money to start out with so be careful. Do your research upfront on the companies and you should be fine. You also have to decide what type of investing you are doing. Are you playing the game doing shorts or putting money in there for the long term? You don't necessarily want to wrap up money in the stock market that you are saving for a house downpayment or something like that because you could potentially lose a lot pulling it out when the time comes to buy a house and you need the downpayment. Overall, as with any risk, you need to weigh your options and go from there. As mentioned, my recommendation is that you search this forum for similar questions and you will find plenty of information on the subject of getting started with stocks. If you don't want to go through it like the rest of us when we started, give your money to a broker and pray he has your best interest at heart. I started with $100 and have grown from there. Starting with $20-30k has a lot of potential (both for making money & losing money), so be careful. If you are putting the money in for the long haul, watch anchor stocks like Google, Microsoft, GE, utilities, etc... or go with ETFs which are pretty close to automatic diversification. Oh and btw, if you don't want to do the research or work with a broker, remember you can always find a bank that will give you 5% or so with pretty much no risk. Weigh what you want to do. Mike P.S. Lay off the language in these forums, this isn't the street and the adjective you used was completely unnecessary. Thanks."

Petree Dish said: "Thank you for giving me a quality reply to work with. I'm already in the middle of purchasing a house so I don't need to concern myself with pulling money out down the line to make a down payment. I already have money in mutual funds, 401k, ISOP, and a CD account with Bank of America. I don't plan on using a broker, to be honest I just don't trust them. It would have to be some type of family friend and even then I am very hesitant to use one. I feel that I am savvy enough to do the legwork myself and make some good decisions. My plan for this money is long term. At least 10 years, I dont plan on pulling it out anytime soon and spending it. Sorry for my language in my OP. Regards, B"

Bob_sapp said: "If I were in the middle of purchasing a house, I would put all my money into that, and look at stocks later."

molder101 said: "Bob makes a smart point. If you have 20k - 30k EXTRA laying around when buying a house, you are doing well. While I understand Bob's point, I do not necessarily recommend you put that money into the house. You want to have a decent down payment but your interest is tax deductible so that helps to offset the interest paid. Most millionaires pay interest, it all comes down to making the money work for you. I would, before putting that 20k - 30k into stocks make sure I have the following: 1) maxing out 401k contributions, 2) (at least a) 6 month security fund for all your necessary expenses (mortgage, insurance, taxes, food, etc). (Put that security fund into an ING account or similar so it is freely accessible for emergencies. CDs arent good for emergency funds because they can have steep penalties.) If, after those are covered, you still have money left over, definitely have a little fun in the stock market. I always tell people not to put more money in than you are willing to lose. It's kind of like going to the casino, you figure out how much you are willing to lose and once you have lost it, you stop playing. (BTW that goes two ways... if you say $100 is your limit and with that you make $500... losing the $500 you make is NOT breaking even... it's losing $400.) Anyway, my original recommendations stand. Get a sogotrade or similar account and put the money into ETFs. They have low, low costs and over time will beat the market (typically) because they are inherently diversified. Anyone can buy a stock and lose money on it or vice versa. If you don't have time to watch the market, you're much better off with ETFs or anchor companies that I mentioned. These larger companies are able to make it through rough times better than smaller ones that bust or get bought out. If you are financially smart, regardless of whether or not you make lots of money, you can secure a financial future that many only dream of - you just have to keep everything in perspective (sometimes that means you have to hold onto the 32" lcd instead of upgrading to the 52" the next door neighbor has)."

rmani said: "i agree with the above post make sure you have some cash around for emergencies, but i think mutual funds are a good way to get started. no fee funds are great and you can even open an etrade account if you want, find yourself a highly rated fund and start a monthly investing plan. I don't think of the market as being nearly as risky as gambling either if you stick to blue chips stocks, and 4 & 5 star rated mutual funds. If you're really scared talk to a broker, but be weary of excessive fees."

Petree Dish said: "Great post Molder! If you could, could you please take a look through my post here. I am very interested in what you had to say and am very close to going out tomorrow and trying to do that exact plan you layed out. Thanks mate! [QUOTE=molder101;72379]Bob makes a smart point. If you have 20k - 30k EXTRA laying around when buying a house, you are doing well.[/QUOTE] Thanks! I am fortunate to have nice parents who let me live with them for free and save my money! We (my father and I) are buying the house as an investment, and lucky enough for me I am at the perfect age to move out and still get a great deal on a piece of real estate. I wanted to go legit and live at home for a few years, then put a down payment on a house myself, but the market is at such a favorable time to buy, that we are making this decision as a team rather than being prideful (obviously I am filled with joy ;) ) [QUOTE=molder101;72379]While I understand Bob's point, I do not necessarily recommend you put that money into the house. You want to have a decent down payment but your interest is tax deductible so that helps to offset the interest paid. Most millionaires pay interest, it all comes down to making the money work for you.[/QUOTE] Sorry I dont quite understand this interest business. I know I know, but Im young! take it easy on me! :) [QUOTE=molder101;72379]I would, before putting that 20k - 30k into stocks make sure I have the following: 1) maxing out 401k contributions, 2) (at least a) 6 month security fund for all your necessary expenses (mortgage, insurance, taxes, food, etc). (Put that security fund into an ING account or similar so it is freely accessible for emergencies. CDs arent good for emergency funds because they can have steep penalties.)[/QUOTE] 1. How much does it usually cost to max out 401k contribution (i have no idea) 2. I like this security fund idea allot! makes perfect sense! I need to read about what an ING account is!... do they have interest? [QUOTE=molder101;72379]If, after those are covered, you still have money left over, definitely have a little fun in the stock market. I always tell people not to put more money in than you are willing to lose. It's kind of like going to the casino, you figure out how much you are willing to lose and once you have lost it, you stop playing. (BTW that goes two ways... if you say $100 is your limit and with that you make $500... losing the $500 you make is NOT breaking even... it's losing $400.)[/QUOTE] I am willing to lose 20k! Well.... maybe not... hahaha :D But I know of a niche market that is going to EXPLODE in the next coming years, they say the retrofit market for this technology is in the thirties of Billions!!!! and thats just RETROFIT market... [QUOTE=molder101;72379]Anyway, my original recommendations stand. Get a sogotrade or similar account and put the money into ETFs. They have low, low costs and over time will beat the market (typically) because they are inherently diversified.[/QUOTE] I need to read about ETFs too... [QUOTE=molder101;72379]Anyone can buy a stock and lose money on it or vice versa. If you don't have time to watch the market, you're much better off with ETFs or anchor companies that I mentioned. These larger companies are able to make it through rough times better than smaller ones that bust or get bought out.[/QUOTE] Good points here ^^^ [QUOTE=molder101;72379]If you are financially smart, regardless of whether or not you make lots of money, you can secure a financial future that many only dream of - you just have to keep everything in perspective (sometimes that means you have to hold onto the 32" lcd instead of upgrading to the 52" the next door neighbor has).[/QUOTE] ^^^ TRUFE"

molder101 said: "Im in a similar boat as you. The real estate market is great right now and rates for contractors are at an "all time" low. There is so much competition in the marketplace, I've decided that I'm going to build a house. Taking on such a responsibility requires a ridiculous amount of research, so that's where all this is coming from - research. It's amazing what you can do when you spend a little time learning about a subject. (BTW so everyone knows that it's possible, I'm a 26 year old that sells insurance.) Oh and there's rarely a GOOD reason to move out prematurely, it's a smart financial decision to stick around since you can save the most when you are young and don't necessarily have the bills you will later on. Now to address your questions... Great to hear you are buying a piece of real estate. Make sure you do your due diligence. Go to the tax collector and find out how much the property sold for previously, the amount of taxes, if there are any leins or abatements, and absolutely make sure you have a home inspection done from a reputable company. A few extra dollars upfront could equal a savings of thousands in the back end. You are able to write off the interest you pay on your mortgage. It's a good thing because you are going to pay a ton. The average loan at 6% with a 200,000 starting value will cost you over $200,000 in interest over 30 years. Make sure you check out shortcuts like paying your mortgage biweekly instead of monthly to see how you can shave 5-7 years off your mortgage. There's lots of other ways too save too. The first year you buy the home, make sure you have a good accountant or tax service perform your taxes. You will pay more than doing it online for free (or cheap) but they are much more in tune with current laws and will be able to get you the most deductions based on your new "situation" as a (co)homeowner. If you have an employer that matches your 401k contributions, make sure you max them out. The total you can add to your 401k is 15,500 this year. That's more than most of us can afford to add, but figure out the max your company will contribute and make sure you take advantage of it - it's free money - the return on investment is ENORMOUS. My employer matches up to 2% of my salary only. Currently they contribute $100 per month which is $1,200. I put in $25/wk which comes out to $1,300/yr. So that's $2,500 a year I put away at only $25/wk just for my 401K. Awesome eh? Oh and don't forget that is tax free so that's $1,300 in income that I make every year that I am not taxed on. (401k contributions are pretax, you get taxed when you take them out.) ING is an excellent company. They have a variable interest rate but are very quick to adjust it as the market dictates. Currently the rate is 3.00%. If you want to start up an account PM me and I will send you a link. You'll get a $25 bonus to open an account (I get $10). Then just leave this money in that account until you need it (if ever). You can adjust the amount you keep in there as the amount it costs you to live changes, but I definitely recommend at least a 6-month cushion, especially if you have the money now to be able to do it. You will definitely run into problems in life. Financially smart people planned for them years in advance. Great that you know a market that will potentially explode. However keep in mind that it can explode and well nothing be left just as easy. Two examples: I'm following an IPO from the end of last month... it started at $16.50 and was sold to a lot of investors. The morning after, one of the companies largest clients announced they gave their contract to a competitor. The stock plummeted to $9.55. Now there is a class action lawsuit against the company for misrepresentation with regards to the IPO etc. Another company I am looking at Elan (symbol ELN), which I posted about on this forum, is a pharmaceutical company which I bought into years ago and sold. Their stock was consistently climbing and topped out at about $37. News of a potential correlation with a drug it produces and brain cancer dropped the stock to around $10 a share. It's up a few bucks, but stocks are definitely a risky business especially since you can't monitor them 100% of the day unless that's your job (or youre nuts). Anytime I hear that a stock is going to be huge, I look more at the prospectus or financials. Often it's even difficult to find the sneaky tactics companies use in there but it's better than going in blind. Just be careful. Great article in getting started with ETFs is: [url]http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/StartInvesting/StartInvestingWithJust100.aspx?f=255[/url]. It's actually how I started in "stocks." Originally I followed it to a "T" even using sharebuilder as they suggested. Sharebuilder has since been bought by ING but I've moved my funds to Sogotrade because they are cheaper and their system is better because it allows for real time trades. Google "ETFs" and you'll find more information than you can handle. The ones in the article are very good with Vanguard being towards the top end given their excellent low expense ratio. Buy some books, read some articles here & there, and you'll be on your way. Obviously we will never be as good an investor as someone that eat/breathes/sleeps investing, but I'd rather not do that anyway. Even though we may not have as much information we can apply the same priniciples as the big guys. There is no reason why every American can't be rich. Somehow Americans have lost focus of the American dream and replaced it with instant satisfaction (victims of advertising, credit cards etc). I've been fortunate to be able to know and talk with very successful people that came through the depression. Not only are they financially secure but they are nice people. Earning money will always make you a happier person than getting it in a windfall and it will also make you think twice about wasting it. (That's why I'm not necessarily looking to win the lotto - I dont play, or hit the jackpot - I dont gamble, or rob a bank - Im not a criminal ;-) As a side note, I just read a great article in a magazine about wealthy people that have between $1M and $2.5 million. They tend to be pretty thrifty with their money since that's not as much as it used to be. Neat things they did to have a great lifestyle without PAYING DEARLY for it were: 1) instead of buying an exotic sports car (ferrari, lamborghini, etc), they are in a club that allows them to take a different ones each weekend - I think it was $30,000/yr). But that is way cooler than just having one car and a lot cheaper, plus you can stop/start at any time and not have a car to sell or whatever. 2) Lots of other people buy fractional ownership of a private jet. Instead of paying millions for a jet & crew, you pay a small amount of money (proportionally) and still get the same thing. 3) Many take advantage of a concierge service that can handle their vacations, get them whatever they want, etc. It's like having a staff (or posse depending on the type of person you are!) that does whatever you want them to, but without the payroll (and aggrevation). 4) People rent high end luxury items like purses that cost $10,000 or better for a hundred a month or so. If you really want those type of luxuries there are ways to obtain them other than paying the sticker price. Start young, weigh the true cost of something before you buy it (ie a car is not just the sticker price, there is a cost to running it, maintaining it etc - and it varies substantially between vehicles) and you will be fine. Oh and get on track before you get married, so you do it naturally before she tries to change you! (I'm not married, but I have friends! Keep in mind though, that saving money is not an excuse to have fun and treat her well. It is an excuse though for her not to buy those Prada shoes and Luise V bag.) The best quote I've read about money is, "Save it now, so you can spend it when you want to." (Not: spend it now, so you are in debt the rest of your life as too many people do.) Good luck to you!"

molder101 said: "BTW, since you are looking into buying a house, if it's owner occupied you can take advantage of this new deal through the government: [url]http://www.federalhousingtaxcredit.com/index.html[/url] It's essentially a 0% interest loan for up to $7500 for 15 years in the form of tax credits. Every little bit helps."

Petree Dish said: "Thanks Molder. I am trying to get enough time to write a decent reply to your last post."